×

8
9

Another Westman Interview (self.MauraMurrayEvidence)

submitted by [deleted]

WESTMAN INTERVIEW

01/08/2006
16:00hrs

Interview of Tim and Faith Westman (owners of The Weathered Barn, amd who live across from the accident site)

I went to North Haverhill on Rt. 112 to view the Maura Murray accident site. While there, I parked across the street from the Westman residence and saw that they were home in the kitchen and decided to interview them about what they had seen and done on February 9th, 2004.

(*name of interviewer "APN" ***) I spoke to the Westmans in their kitchen after they invited us inside. They were interviewed together while we stood in their kitchen. During this time, I was able to get a direct view of what they would have seen that night. They had a very clear view of the accident scene. There is also a street light outside their house on the corner lighting up that area fairly well.

The Westmans told us that they were the first to see the accident scene. They heard the collision and watched out their window the entire time. (As an aside, they said that the tree the ribbon is on is the wrong tree that was hit in the accident, and it is actually closer to the corner). Neither of them went out to the scene when it happened but Tim Westman said that he went out later after all the fire department people and police were there and saw the car close up. He said that there wasn’t much snow on the snow banks and that the car could be walked around without trouble. The car looked like it was parked on the roadway and didn’t readily look like it had crashed.

Mrs. Westman said she called 911 right away and had no trouble getting through. Either 911 or the police department hung up with them after getting their information (I didn’t ask which entity she talked to).

Both the Westmans said that they saw whoever had been in the car when it crashed get in and out of the car several times. They made sure to say that they could not recognize it as Maura Murray because it was too dark, but they could see the form of someone moving around. They said that they saw the interior light go on and off several times and heard the doors shut as if someone kept getting in and out of the car. They also said they saw the person open the trunk and close it as well during this time. They never saw anyone else around that car besides that one person and never saw any other vehicles stop, prior to police arrival, other than a school bus.

The Westmans said that 4 to 5 minutes after the car crashed, they saw a school bus come from aroul1d the comer and stop in the road next to the car. They didn’t see who was driving but heard later that it was Butch Atwood. They said that his wife also drives bus and also is large like he is so it very well could have been her for all they knew. They indicated they understood his wife did not have his last name but went by *****. The Westmans said that the school bus was between them and Maura and that she had gotten out of the car, but he did not get on the bus. It seemed that the bus driver talked to her for no more than two minutes and the driver never got out of the bus, or out of the seat for that matter. The driver drove off and the car’s driver went back to the car.

When I asked the Westman’s about the timeline between that point and when the police arrived, they said that it took about 15 minutes for the police to arrive after the bus left. They felt sure that it could have been that long but no shorter than 10 minutes. During this time, they saw someone smoking a cigarette from inside the car from the front passenger side seat. Tim Westman said that he had told Fred Murray about that but he insisted his daughter did not smoke, so it must have been the light from her cell phone he said.

The Westmans said that the light inside the car and trunk kept going on and off and finally there were no lights on at all. No more than two minutes after that point, the police cruiser arrived. Shortly thereafter, a police officer knocked on their door asking if anyone from the car accident had come to their residence and they said no.

Both Tim and Faith Westman say they are positive that nobody walked by their house (back towards Route 10)...they said that they could see clearly out in front of their house and would have seen her go by...plus the officer came from that way and didn’t see her. (I was there when it turned dark and the light is fairly bright and the house is close to the road). They feel that she must have walked the other way.

The Westmans said that EMS and Fire showed up and that for about an hour they all walked around looking throughout the area. When they were done, there were footprints all over the place and any follow up would have been difficult.

I asked the Westmans about the Atwood family. They said they didn’t know them very well. They kept to themselves and had no children they said. They weren’t openly neighborly, but thought that Mr. Marotte who lived across the road from them was.

all 20 comments
sorted by:
best
topnewcontroversialoldq&a

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (8 children)

After having been on that road, which is quite narrow and the distance between TWB and BA's shorter than what pictures show, I'm thinking it more likely she either got in a car or bolted down Old Peters.

Remember the footprints behind The Marrottes'? LE said, "not her's" but there's several property owners who've refused access back there.

Yeah.

[–]Lethenial 5 points6 points  (4 children)

I always wanted to clarify this because for the life of me I can't find this road on google maps. Is Old Peters the road now called "Maguire" right before the WB? or what is it refering to?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Dirt road, right at the elbow.

[–]Lethenial 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Aah got it, thanks. Was driving me mad haha.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Didn't drive it.

[–]Lethenial 4 points5 points  (7 children)

Very interesting HunterPense, thank you for sharing. Nice to get a clean view on their statements again, especially from 2006 so in current terms very short after the incident.

What stood out to me was them saying they saw lights inside and in the trunk go off for a while until 2 minutes before the police arrive (heard a scanner call?!), wich sounds odd to me coupled with what we learned from the call logs and time stamps. In one version the Westmanns claim to keep watching, in other statements they turned away, wich is it?

Anyways, if they are to be beleived on this version, that would according to them give Maura about two minutes to get away before police arrived (lights turning off etc) wich means she would have gone east. However, according to BA he was on the porch making his calls at that time (discussion still on wich side that porch is), he says he never saw or head anything apart from a few cars. So basically she either probably went around back, or was picked up in those 2 minutes (lets make it 5 just to be sure, feeling time go by is a tricky thing).

It also does not match with witness A driving by at 7:35 seeing an LE vehicle if they are watching the scene the entire time (A said LE-vehicles lights were on).

[–]Random_TN 6 points7 points  (6 children)

or was picked up in those 2 minutes (lets make it 5 just to be sure, feeling time go by is a tricky thing).

yet they said... "and never saw any other vehicles stop, prior to police arrival, other than a school bus "

So if this is to be believed, they weren't watching all the time, or she got picked up down the street, or she just ran up the road, maybe to a house. Whatever it was, she got out of sight very, very fast.

[–]Lethenial 2 points3 points  (5 children)

Agreed, wich makes it very supsicious to me. Its just such a short time frame to disappear in, quite coincidentally really, when apparently 3 seperates houses are keeping an eye on the situation and a police car on the way.

[–]damolhorn 2 points3 points  (4 children)

Nice job, Hunter. As usual. The fifteen minutes between Butch arrival and police arrival lends itself to the 7:46 arrival of Cecil. The one thing that is curious to me though is that they seem to imply she was there 2 minutes before Cecil shows up and then poof was gone. Meanwhile Butch is on his porch watching the East direction, while the Westmans are covering the West direction.

So...to Mac’s suggestion, Old Peters road looks viable. What about snow on that dirt road? Was there any that we know of?

Another scenario, with her seeming to disappear in the blink of an eye...what if she sees the police lights coming in the distance. Witness A mentions seeing the police lights ahead of her as it went up and over hills. What if Maura sees the police lights from a 1/2 mile away, and in a last ditch effort to hide, she jumps into her own trunk. Used the clicker/fob to lock the doors, to make it appear the car is abandoned. She could have exited through her backseat once car was at Lavoie’s. I had a 95 Saturn. There was a latch/button where u could put the seat down from the trunk side.

[–]Lethenial 4 points5 points  (2 children)

I doubt the trunk thing, for that to work out there would have to be so many coincidences, including an unlocked garage at LaVoies. Though I guess it is plausible, for me I'd rank it lower on the list.

The seeing of the flashing lights however I find interesting, it is possible she reacted to that and dashed down old peters for example. I'm not sure about footsteps in the snow, however there has long been talk about a possible sighting/encounter where a dog being walked got spooked by something/someone in the dark.

[–]damolhorn 0 points1 point  (1 child)

True, unless LaVoie caught her trying to escape his garage and did something sinister or accidentally shot her thinking she was a burglar. Have no reason to think that of him but who the hell knows?

Valid point on the dogs getting spooked. Was that account on Bradley Hill or on Old Peters, can’t remember

[–]Lethenial 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It was on old Peters as far as I recall. That road goes very far, though it would be hella hard to navigate in the dark.

[–]Angiemarie23 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I’ve thought of the trunk thing before but instead of her leaving out of lavoies garage they find Maura in the trunk deceased she went and hid in the trunk but couldn’t get out by the time they do a full search on vehicle she had passed, they panic cause it’s in a personal garage and do a cover up. But I’m sure they wouldn’t have been able to cover up the smell in the trunk by the Friday when Fred comes to see it. I do not believe this is what happens it’s just one of those crazy thoughts I have had on this case.

[–]wolves_lower[🍰] 3 points4 points  (7 children)

Trying to square the times given in this article with other known timeline facts, correct me if I'm wrong:

Crash: 7:25 to 7:26

Faith looks out her window: 7:26

Faith calls 911: 7:27

Butch arrives: 7:29 to 7:30

Butch leaves: 7:31 to 7:32

Westmans say police arrive 10 to 15 minutes after Butch leaves: 10 minutes = 7:41/7:42. 15 minutes = 7:46/7:47.

Did the Westman's just not see the police SUV that Karen saw at the scene between 7:36 and 7:37? Or was Karen was able to get through to her voice mail well before the Beaver Pond pull off, meaning she could have passed the scene later than 7:37? Did SUV001 arrive at 7:35, leave, and another police vehicle arrive between 7:41 and 7:47?

If Cecil was driving SUV001, it looks like he arrived at 7:35, left at some point, and then returned, somewhere around 7:45. Where could he have gone, and why?

[–]TTG1888 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Very much the same thoughts that I was having, but if CS did arrive earlier and made a cursory inspection of the car (bearing in mind the W's say they saw lights going on and off until 2 minutes before police arrival) how could he not see anyone and why would he not have knocked on their door?

[–]wolves_lower[🍰] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

She could have left between 7:33 and 7:34, either walked down the road or gotten into a car, although I'm not sure how Butch and or even the Marottes would have missed either event. FW says no cars came or went after she called 911 and before police arrived. Butch was very likely parking his bus right up until 7:34 or 7:35, so she would have walked right past him, or he would have seen a car stop. Most likely scenario to me is she got into 011, which left and then either came back at 7:46, or didn't. Its very possible Cecil got there in a sedan at 7:46, when he originally said he did. Seems like without photos of the scene we'll never know for sure.

[–]TTG1888 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Certainly possible that she got into 001 and that would also account for the fact there was no screaming or struggling if she thought she was being arrested or taken to a police station. If she did walk anywhere, the most logical place I can see would be Old Peters (or possibly the game trail) as this would not take her past witnesses and I think had she stayed on a main road she would have been seen by someone. FW also says that lights were going on and off in the car and someone was moving around it up until a couple of minutes before the police arrived, which if CS means she was there up until about 7.43/44, unless there was another car there as seen by Witness A approximately 7 minutes earlier. I think that the answer is one of these two scenarios, but we don't have enough to go on to prove or disprove anything at present.